ArmInfo. Armenian Prime Minister Nikol Pashinyan believes in the possibility of achieving a lasting peace with Azerbaijan. He stated this in an interview with Agence France-Presse in response to a question whether he believes in a lasting peace with Azerbaijan.
"If I didn't believe, there would be no point in taking part in the negotiations at all, but believing does not mean that the result is guaranteed, because, understandably, it depends not only on me, naturally, it depends also on the positions of the President of Azerbaijan, let alone that we are not generally negotiating in a vacuum. There is an international situation, there is a geopolitical situation, there is a humanitarian situation, there are various human factors, which may emerge at any point and time. Everything influences the process, but of course, the greatest impact on the process have the direct negotiators, I mean, the President of Azerbaijan and myself," Pashinyan stressed. To clarify what he can personally do in negotiations with President Aliyev to guarantee the dignity of the Armenians living in Nagorno-Karabakh, Pashinyan pointed to the importance of the conditions.
"You know, generally the conditions are very important. If we just step aside from the substance of the negotiations, because for an impartial observer of what's happening in the negotiations room, one might think that in principle, everything is fine, that there is really nothing extraordinary happening, but then, after that, we need to come back and observe the actions and statements that are being made. The most important thing, which in my opinion impedes the progress of the talks, is Azerbaijan's continued aggressive rhetoric, hate speech towards Armenians and anything that is Armenian, hate actions, and of course, the policy of revenge in relation to Armenians of Nagorno Karabakh and obviously, the policy of ethnic cleansing."
As an illustrative example, he suggested looking at the current situation in Nagorno- Karabakh. The prime minister pointed to the humanitarian crisis in Artsakh, the lack of essentials.
"Look at the situation that we now have in Nagorno Karabakh. We have a humanitarian crisis there. When we say humanitarian crisis, for many people it may seem like a political term or a headline for news, but let's delve into its substance. It means, for instance, absence of essential goods, there is no vegetable oil in Nagorno Karabakh, no sugar, there are no hygiene supplies, there is no butter, there aren't several types of foodstuff. The people of Nagorno Karabakh are hard working people of course, and in this agricultural season some products are produced, but because of the absence of fuel, the delivery of the goods to the potential consumers is almost impossible. In Karabakh, there is a certain stock of grain, but because of the absence of fuel, it cannot be delivered to the flour mills, if in any way it is possible to deliver it to the flour mills, then it cannot be delivered to the bread bakeries because of absence of fuel, and if somehow it reaches the bakeries, it is impossible to bake the bread at industrial volumes because of the absence of electricity and fuel, but if it is somehow possible to bake it, then it is impossible to deliver it to the shops, and if somehow it is possible to deliver to the shops, people have transport limitations for reaching the shop to buy the bread, and if somehow they reach the shop to buy the bread, they do not have the required financial means to purchase the bread because they are deprived of employment.
If all these layers, all these difficulties are placed upon one individual, all that burden becomes obvious and understandable. Under these circumstances, it is clear that in the Republic of Armenia and also of course in Nagorno Karabakh, pessimism is growing day by day, which, however, does not change our policy in any way, because we are convinced that the method of resolving issues through negotiations has no alternative. And on the other hand, if issues are not resolved through negotiations, in the public these negotiations may be perceived as just waste of time, or creating the impression in the media that something is being done. These are all risks that can directly or indirectly affect the process," he said.
To clarify what his red lines are in this process, Pashinyan stated, "We have said this a number of times: Armenia's territorial integrity, sovereignty, and the rights and security of the Armenians of Nagorno Karabakh. By the way, there is an important point to be made: rights and security on this level are terms, for people they are just terms. It's very important that the terms be reflected in a way that people will be able to use, apply them, to have the rights and the security that would enable them to live, to self-realize in their environment, in their family, to develop within that environment.
It's also very important to record that our position is that the issue of rights and security of the people of Nagorno Karabakh should be addressed in a dialogue, talks and discussions with the participation of the people of Nagorno Karabakh. We call that Baku-Stepanakert dialogue, but given the disproportion of strength between Nagorno Karabakh and Azerbaijan, we think that if we leave Stepanakert and Baku face to face, Baku will have the opportunity of either turning that agenda into oblivion, or have a monologue and not a dialogue. And that's why our perception is that that dialogue should take place in the context of an international mechanism, where the international community will be the witness. Armenia's role here is difficult because Armenia's interest in this process is perceived and interpreted by Azerbaijan as so-called encroachment or aspiration upon Azerbaijan's territorial integrity. Because of that perception talks in this format have not turned out to be constructive, and this has been demonstrated by the whole history of negotiations."
To a remark, that Armenia is seeking certain international mechanisms that will guarantee the security and rights of the Armenian population of Karabakh. And what international mechanisms he means, Pashinyan assured:
"You know, these are working-level issues that depend not only on our perceptions. That's why I wouldn't like to limit the future conversations by outlining any particular vision, or that would make limitations for us in those conversations. Our main issue is that for that conversation, that dialogue to take place and to be genuine, to have an actual conversation, because it is through conversation that its is possible to overcome the lack of confidence, hate, and even tensions, or even to better understand one another.
To the comment does he think that Azerbaijan is threatening the sovereignty and territorial integrity of Armenia, particularly considering the situation in Syunik, also the fact that the city of Jermuk came under fire last year and does he consider this a threat from Azerbaijan to the sovereignty and territorial integrity of Armenia, and what does he think, can there be war again, Pashinyan expressed his conviction that in general, so long as a peace treaty has not been signed, and such a treaty has not been ratified by the parliaments of the two countries, of course, war is very likely.
"And generally, anywhere on the planet, where there is conflict situation that has not been resolved by a treaty, has not been addressed anywhere anytime, war may erupt. We need to know this. There are different scales of probability, but we should take this as a rule. Azerbaijan's obvious aggressive rhetoric, hate speech is added to this, the current geopolitical situation is added to this, where essentially the world order that some time ago was presumed to somehow exist, we now see it doesn't exist by and large. This is also contributed by the breaching of the military balance between Armenia and Azerbaijan, and so on and so forth.
And of course new escalations, new wars are always likely, which does not mean that it is going to happen, but it also does not mean that it is not going to happen. By the way, every day, literally, violations of the ceasefire regime occur on the border between Armenia and Azerbaijan. During my term as Prime Minister, in more than five years, there might have been a maximum of three days during which the ceasefire wasn't violated. Can you imagine this? During the five years with the most inflated assessments we may have not more than three days without ceasefire regime violation. One of these days was November 11, 2020, so if we exclude this, two days remain, and one questionable," he noted.